Wikipédia:Bistro des non-francophones/Archives/2018

Traité de Bärwalde and Traité de Barwald

Traité de Bärwalde and Traité de Barwald look like articles about the same thing. Can anyone help confirm about this? Thanks.--ネイ (discuter) 14 janvier 2018 à 18:14 (CET)

Well, it looks like it is the same thing. Assassas77 (discuter) 14 janvier 2018 à 20:03 (CET)

Thank you very much.--ネイ (discuter) 15 janvier 2018 à 03:05 (CET)

April 1st - Wikipedia as Minitel like pages?

(Please feel free to translate this)

On some other Wikipedia there is an unofficial tradition of doing something interesting for April 1st.

I was considering for example makign some examples of what the English Wikivoyage Main page might look like as teletext/videotex style page.

According to English Wikipedia, There was a French developed Videotex system called Minitel, whose development was begun in 1978, 40 years ago, and which wasn't retired until 2012. So in an alternate timeline, maybe there could have been French language Wiki-dervied content on Minitel?

As French Wikipedia users are more likely to be familar with Minitel, then I would be ( UK had a different system called Prestel which had a different technical standard), I was wondering if there was anyone that would be interested in making some mock-ups of what something like Wikipedia on Minitel might have looked like as an item for April 1st? ShakespeareFan00 (discuter) 26 février 2018 à 23:30 (CET)

 ShakespeareFan00 : Copied on Wikipédia:Le Bistro/27 février 2018#1er avril - Wikipédia avec le style graphique du minitel ? Lofhi ^{me contacter} 27 février 2018 à 20:51 (CET)

That's a very nice idea :-) Coding wise, I found two potential resources to emulate Minitel using Javascript: [1] and [2]. --Lrq3000 (discuter) 9 mars 2018 à 04:34 (CET)

After some more digging, I found very good candidates to simulate a minitel interface using quite simple CSS and JS code snippets [3][4][5]. Please see the french thread for more infos :-) --Lrq3000 (discuter) 9 mars 2018 à 05:15 (CET)

Related to this thread I found an (english lnaguage) video clip https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOhK9bgQo8g ShakespeareFan00 (discuter) 15 mars 2018 à 22:04 (CET)

#WeMissTurkey

It is March 2018. Wikipedia is blocked in Turkey. This marks 10 months of people in Turkey having no access to the world’s free knowledge, and people around the world not learning from Turkish citizens. We want to re-energize the conversation around Wikipedia in Turkey and galvanize public opinion to support unblocking the site. To do this, the Wikimedia community are running a week-long social media push to express why #WeMissTurkey. Following from this initial push we would like to run a CentralNotice campaign to further energize the conversation. The campaign will be only be show to users a maximum of two times to limit disruption and show, to between 10-50% of traffic. Banners will be low profile based on the community template with added functionality to expand revealing social sharing options on twitter and facebook for mobile with the possibility of a generic template on desktop. Seddon (WMF) (discuter) 7 mars 2018 à 21:43 (CET)

#WeMissTurkey

It is March 2018. Wikipedia is blocked in Turkey. This marks 10 months of people in Turkey having no access to the world’s free knowledge, and people around the world not learning from Turkish citizens. We want to re-energize the conversation around Wikipedia in Turkey and galvanize public opinion to support unblocking the site. To do this, the Wikimedia community are running a week-long social media push to express why #WeMissTurkey. Following from this initial push we would like to run a CentralNotice campaign to further energize the conversation. The campaign will be only be show to users a maximum of two times to limit disruption and show, to between 10-50% of traffic. Banners will be low profile based on the community template with added functionality to expand revealing social sharing options on twitter and facebook for mobile with the possibility of a generic template on desktop. Seddon (WMF) (discuter) 7 mars 2018 à 21:43 (CET)

Rainbow Ruby on/sur Télémagino

Télémagino in Canada is going to air Rainbow Ruby in French from 9 April 2018. So, how do I write the following sentence in French?

In Quebec, Télémagino will premiere the French version of the series on 9 April 2018.

JSH-alive (discuter) 2 avril 2018 à 03:01 (CEST)

 JSH-alive : There is no direct translation for "premiere". You could either say "Au Québec, la version française de la série sera diffusée à partir du 9 avril 2018 sur Télémagino" (it is like saying "broadcast" instead of "premiere"), or if you want to insist on the fact that it is the first time, "Au Québec, la série sera diffusée pour la première fois en version française à partir du 9 avril 2018 sur Télémagino". Orlodrim (discuter) 2 avril 2018 à 23:33 (CEST)

 Orlodrim : Merci. JSH-alive (discuter) 3 avril 2018 à 03:25 (CEST)

Raïon_de_Haïssyn

Laissez s'il vous plaît Raïon_de_Haïssyn Ce nom moderne. Gaisine-cela le vieux nom des temps de l'URSS. Pendant les URSS la langue française utilisait les noms abîmés par la langue russe. Après la Révolution Orange de 2004 la langue française a refusé d'abîmé soviétique des noms par la langue russe. A passé sur les vrais noms - comme dans la langue ukrainienne. Bohdan Bondar (discuter) 3 avril 2018 à 12:55 (CEST)

Je ne connais pas le sujet, mais personne ne semble contester votre modification. Au contraire, un autre utilisateur a changé l'introduction pour qu'elle soit cohérente avec votre renommage. Orlodrim (discuter) 3 avril 2018 à 18:53 (CEST)

Fanny Bloc

Fanny Bloc is a French voice actress who appeared in many animated shows and films. It's strange to see that there's no article about her in any edition of Wikipedia (including the French Wikipedia right here). JSH-alive (discuter) 8 juin 2018 à 06:59 (CEST)

The small article (1.5 ko), without any source, was deleted after a unanimous AfD. — Zebulon84 (discuter) 9 juin 2018 à 02:29 (CEST)

Okay. There was an attempt. Where should I go to formally ask for article creation? In fact, I can't find a fitting category for voice actress within Wikipédia:Articles à créer. (And I'm not sure if "Fanny Bloc" is a real name or not.) JSH-alive (discuter) 9 juin 2018 à 15:18 (CEST)

 JSH-alive : as the article was deleted after an AfD, it have to go through the equivalent or en:Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion : Wikipédia:Demande de restauration de page. And you have to provide serious sources, otherwise the demand will be dismissed. — Zebulon84 (discuter) 9 juin 2018 à 18:59 (CEST)

Copyright changes

As some here may be aware, there are some planned (and in my opinion illogical) changes to EU copyright policy being proposed.

Amongst them would be a requirement to filter user submitted content for copyrighted works, something that is hard to do, and given that it amounts to editorial influence by the platform, affect certain other protections Wikipedia's have previously enjoyed even outside nominal EU jurisdiction.

I was advised on IRC, to bring disscusion about how to respond to this on-wiki( partly so it can be translated more effectively than on IRC).

Although it may be too radical one proposal I was going to suggest was that some Wikipedia's most affected by the change ( like French Wikipedia) quietly 'disconnect' or 'vanish' articles related to those interests that want tighter copyright controls, or it seems don't want their content (or knoweldege about it) to be shared.

If they don't want to share, French Wikipedia can I think (and probably should) respect that, but No sharing means No links, No coverage. (Just like Brexit has been indicated to have consequences, so should respecting a 'non-share' viewpoint, have appropriate consequences ;) )

Under this, a topic on something related to a "non-share" party would be replaced with something like : "Wikipedia is unable to cover this topic because of the decision of a related third party, to express a view that they do not want their content (or knowledge of it) to be shared.

Wikipedia being a responsive platform, respects that not everyone wants to share, and so has temporarily removed content relating to that party or their works. If you would like to see this topic covered, please contact the parties related and politely encourage them to re-think their position. "

Short, but appropriately worderd it should focus attention, whereas a general blackout would not. ShakespeareFan00 (discuter) 20 juin 2018 à 18:07 (CEST)

 Pyb : que la question intéresse. --Shev (discuter) 20 juin 2018 à 18:16 (CEST)

thx  Shev123 :

Hi  ShakespeareFan00 :,

Do you know that Wikimedia projects are exempt from the Articles 11 and 13? The Council and European Parliament (JURI) text say different things, but both exclude us. So it depends on the final agreed upon version of the text. JURI text says "Services acting in a non-commercial purpose capacity" and the Council text includes in its scope any service that gives access to content "which it organises and promotes for profit-making purposes." There is another mention dedicated to our projects: "non-for-profit online encyclopaedias, non-for-profit educational and scientific repositories".

So Wikipedia will not directly and immediately suffer from this law. Pyb (discuter) 20 juin 2018 à 18:28 (CEST)

The precise meaning of 'non-profit' and 'non-commerical' are open to interpretation, Commons allows commercial re-use of files from the repository, even if it's not making money itself. Creative Commons license (unless they are NC) allow for commercial re-use so... Wikipedia MAY (and I use MAY here) be unaffected, but Article 11 and 13 are still objectionable, as they make it harder to reuse content. On the other hand, if it means genuinly education images get put on Commons rather than Flikr, because there's less upload hassle... ShakespeareFan00 (discuter) 20 juin 2018 à 18:39 (CEST)

Baltic region

Hello there! I would like to ask your help. Currently, there is two articles about Baltic region in France:

• Baltikum (Q805727 (« Baltikum »)) and Région de la Baltique (Q579938 (« Région de la Baltique »))

In my opinion, these Wikidata items should be merged. Could you merge these two France articles if you can confirm that their content could be in one article? Currently, these items have 29+4 links. Please ping me if you answer! Best regards, Bencemac (discuter) 12 juillet 2018 à 19:12 (CEST)

Hi Bencemac,

It's a little bit different.

The article Baltikum is about an historical notion and region, not matching the current notion of the Baltic area, the subject of the Région de la Baltique. --Dereckson (discuter) 16 juillet 2018 à 12:18 (CEST)

 Dereckson : I see. Thanks your answer! Bencemac (discuter) 20 juillet 2018 à 15:22 (CEST)

Is the FRwiki community willing to have a Simple French Wikipedia be incubated on here?

Dear French Wikipedia users,

I was informed that meta:Requests for new languages/Wikipedia French Simple 3 is eligible for a project, but that Langcom would prefer having the Simple French Wikipedia incubated on FRwiki instead of on Meta. There needs to be a community discussion on whether FRwiki users are okay with this. If not, there are some other ways forward (so the project isn't in jeopardy if FRwiki says no), but if so, then the process may begin :)

@Ajraddatz @AJona1992 @Aridd @Yottie @Ansei @Eptalon @Dereckson @Embu wiki @StevenJ81

Thank you, WhisperToMe (discuter) 7 août 2018 à 16:37 (CEST)

 Pyb : Si je comprends bien il y a une demande pour une version de wikipédia en français simple. --Shev (discuter) 7 août 2018 à 16:44 (CEST)

I can't speak about rulesets, in English, there are different rulesets/wordlists for specialized vocabularies (like for media usage, British English, with 850 and 1500 words..); I guess these exists for French as well. The big question though: can we keep the two "separate enough" that this will work out? - Do you think we can get a base of at least 20 editors wanting to contribute? --Eptalon (discuter) 7 août 2018 à 16:48 (CEST)

Personally, no matter how you want to set up this, I'm totally in favour of a Simple French Wikipedia. So it's a yes for me. --— Embu ^[Discussion] 7 août 2018 à 17:35 (CEST)

Yes, I think a « Français simple » edition would be a good idea. At least, I see no reason not to give it a try in an incubator incorporated within the French Wikipedia. Aridd (discuter) 8 août 2018 à 14:50 (CEST)

I love the idea of a Simple French Wikipedia! — Exilexi ^[Discussion] 8 août 2018 à 15:00 (CEST)

But I am not sure such a ruleset/worldlist (français de base, français simple, français simplifié vocabulaire minimum, ou autre) exists. --Pa2chant. (discuter) 8 août 2018 à 15:14 (CEST)

I would go with Français simplifié or Français scolaire, I think. Français de base sounds weird and français simple is a rather literal translation of the English version. — Exilexi ^[Discussion] 8 août 2018 à 15:17 (CEST)

Radio France International uses the term "français facile". Français scolaire is IMO too vague (there are multiple school curricula around the world...). By the way, there is also already Vikidia, aimed at children and written in a simple French language. Skimel (discuter) 8 août 2018 à 15:43 (CEST)

Isn't the current version simple enough ? TuhQueur (discuter) 8 août 2018 à 16:29 (CEST)

Although I'm no longer active that much as an editor, I do believe the project is worth pursuing. French is too often over-complicated and if anything is easier to simplify than English. @Eptalon It would be possible to collate/create similar lists for a French version. They would likely not mirror the BE850/1500, however they could be based on a variety of most commonly used French words lists. I also favour français simplifié, as suggested by Exilexi. Sounds most natural to me. --Yottie (discuter) 11 août 2018 à 01:19 (CEST)

@WhisperToMe:Sorry; I just saw this. (Pings don't work unless you remove the signature and re-add it.)
To all: I just made a comment in the main discussion, but would reiterate here: This project would have to be based on français fondamental or it would fall outside the LangCom guidelines. Naturally, a community will have to be able to address items that aren't really covered explicitly within français fondamental. Still, we don't want to create a brand new "simple French" variety here; we want to use something established and recognized. Any questions, please ask. StevenJ81 (discuter) (clerk of the Language Committee) 20 août 2018 à 18:18 (CEST)

@WhisperToMe I like very much the idea of a Wikipedia in French Simple but I'm a bit unsure on incubating here, how would it look like? For the big question about the name, I would go with « français facile » (« français simplifié » is a bit deprecative - and simplifié is not a simple word ;) - and « français scolaire » doesn't mean anything, kindergarten or university are both school, and the project doesn't target the children - there is Vikidia and Co for that). « français fondamental » and « français élémentaire » could also be valid option but I’m not really convinced, again « fondamental » and « élémentaire » are not simple words. Fo references, the Google ngram of these 5 names for 1988-2008. Cdlt, Vigneron * ^discut. 20 août 2018 à 20:06 (CEST)

Let me just note briefly that what you call it can be whatever you want. The language basis needs to be français fondamental; that’s all. StevenJ81 (discuter) 21 août 2018 à 15:29 (CEST)

Utilisateur:VIGNERON whichever name you like is best. I'm happy with "français facile"! WhisperToMe (discuter) 26 août 2018 à 03:12 (CEST)

@VIGNERON et @WhisperToMe Ditto from me. Basis should be français fondamental as far as is useful, but it can certainly be called "français facile". StevenJ81 (discuter) 27 août 2018 à 17:10 (CEST)

It’s obviously not my place to close this. But it sounds as if this community is willing to let this happen. So as soon as there is some sort of main landing page for the effort, let me know, so that I can close the request on Meta and point people to it. StevenJ81 (discuter) 28 août 2018 à 15:41 (CEST)

Late piece of advice. "Français simple" n'est pas si simple surtout en français. Pour l'exemple, la Science non vulgarisée est SIMPLE mais c'est l'objet de son étude qui est infiniment COMPLEXE. Du coup le français simple peut s'entendre comme un français sans figure de style mais pas moins savant dans ses termes (au contraire...). A la rigueur parler de français facile reflette à la fois un vocabulaire familier en principe non savant d'une part, d'autre part et contrairement au simple english le français familier n'est pas nécessairement fait de mots "petits" ou "non-dérivé" à tout coup, ni exempt de figures de style. C'est davantage un français avec un vocabulaire plus pauvre dans son choix de mots clés, mots clés qui peuvent être dérivés dans une certaine mesure (facile, facilement, difficile, etc). 176.149.114.93 (discuter) 30 septembre 2018 à 00:16 (CEST)

French translation of pt:Wikipédia:Comunicado_sobre_o_Museu_Nacional

Hello! The Portuguese Wikipedia issued a notice asking for images of the National Museum of Brazil, and it is also seeking translations of this notice. Would anyone mind writing a French version?

Thank you, WhisperToMe (discuter) 6 septembre 2018 à 19:39 (CEST)

Thanks to @Odjob16 for translating most of it! There are some parts of pt:Wikipédia:Comunicado_sobre_o_Museu_Nacional/fr that are still in English.WhisperToMe (discuter) 7 septembre 2018 à 10:59 (CEST)

My pleasure, I'm glad to be of help! – Odjob16 (Discuter) 7 septembre 2018 à 16:19 (CEST)

@Odjob16 Hi again! They're asking for additional help here: pt:Wikipédia_Discussão:Comunicado_sobre_o_Museu_Nacional#Links para compartilhamento em redes sociais WhisperToMe (discuter) 10 septembre 2018 à 13:27 (CEST)

Antonius Plautius

Hola, frWiki. Revisando items de Wikidata de los Plaucios, he dado con este artículo (Antonius Plautius). Nunca existió este personaje. Es una invención basada en tres personajes distintos:

• floruit 24. Se basa en el pretor del año 24 Marcus Plautius Silvanus (préteur).
• préteur en 51 av. J.-C. Se basa en el tribuno de la plebe y pretor Aulus Plautius (no hay artículo en frWiki).
• marié avec une certaine Urgulania. Se basa en el cónsul Marcus Plautius Silvanus.

Recomiendo el borrado del artículo. Un saludo. --Romulanus (discuter) 7 octobre 2018 à 15:06 (CEST)

"Disney Play"

Disney is yet to give its upcoming streaming service an official name. The so-called "Disney Play" is a result of a reporter for Variety misinterpreting what Bob Iger said in a Disney telephone conference. (Variety have since corrected the article in question.)

I believe the article currently titled Disney Play here in the French Wikipedia should be renamed either Disney Streaming Services LLC (the company that will operate the upcoming service) or a translation of "Unnamed Walt Disney Company streaming service" in French. JSH-alive (discuter) 8 octobre 2018 à 14:41 (CEST)

Dear JSH-alive, for the moment without more official confirmation from Disney, the article will still be named Disney Play. We will rename it later --GdGourou - Talk to °o° 8 octobre 2018 à 16:29 (CEST)

Wikimedia Sustainability Initiative

Hi all. Please help us to translate Sustainability Initiative on meta in your language and add your name to the list of supporters to show your commitment to environment protection. Let's spread the word! Kind regards, --Daniele Pugliesi (discuter) 28 novembre 2018 à 17:33 (CET)